Rabbi Ross. A few weeks ago, I read your article about kids not going to camp. I have the opposite problem. My kids are all in sleepaway, and I’m quite nervous. Many of these camps tout their amazing learning programs, but when push comes to shove, they don’t learn very much. Davening seems amazing on the camp videos, but my kids tell me it’s a joke. I feel like such a bad mother that I’m sending my son to a camp where the environment is not suitable for a Ben Torah. Who knows what else he’s picking up! I would love to send them to a more Frum camp, but none of his friends are going, and I want him to be with friends. Help. Name Redacted. Cleveland Ohio
Surprisingly enough, I’ve received many similar emails over the past few weeks. I’m actually quite confused by this email and the others like it. Firstly, if you truly believe that the camp you’re sending them to is not a good environment for a Ben Torah, why would you send your child there for the summer? If you are nervous about your son picking up the wrong messages, you can send him to a more “Frum” camp, as you wrote. Perhaps when you wrote “Frum,” you are referring to a more structured camp, which is more serious about davening and learning. Either way, you can certainly try and find one other boy from the neighborhood, or perhaps his school, going to such a camp, and chances are that he’ll make new friends as well. You might be correct in assuming that the learning groups are probably not that serious. I’ve been to many of the sleepaway camps over the years as a learning Rebbe, counselor, speaker or guest. I agree that there is definitely a lot of story time and less serious learning. However, during the summer, many kids look forward to and appreciate having more down time and less structure. (As an aside, some kids need this in order to recharge their batteries after a year of hard work and learning.) Most camps try their best to make the most of the learning time and show that, even during the summer, it’s important to set aside time to learn Torah. If you really care that much about having him learn more seriously or for longer amounts of time, why don’t you have him tutored on the side? Last year, I saw a mother having a serious discussion with her son’s counselor about his Davening in camp. His father told me privately that this same boy plays around the entire Davening on Shabbos. Of course, being the quiet type, I confronted the mother. She explained, “I want people to realize that our family davens well.” There we have it. It’s not about the davening; it’s about the family. As a Rebbe and a father, I do think Davening is very important. However, if you lead by example at home, your kids will likely daven well in camp. I remember when parents were worried about sending kids to sleepaway camps because their boys would only shower once a week (hopefully), wouldn’t brush their teeth (of course not), and rarely change their clothing (why would they?)! Yes, your kids will learn some things that you might not be thrilled about, but they’re not living under a rock. Before they leave to camp, you should have a serious talk with them. You can talk about the importance of personal boundaries, remind them of how special and important davening and learning are, regardless of whether at home or camp, and the importance of good hygiene. When they come back, you can discuss everything and “detox” them if needed. The most important element of camp, from a parent’s perspective, should be the counselor. Sure, it’s nice for a boy to have a good friend in his bunk, but his counselor is the father and mother figure for the summer. If you have any fears or concerns, you can share them with the counselor, via the head staff, and hope for the best. I hope I’m not coming across as non-caring. It’s just that I think that parents these days are rapidly becoming helicopter parents hovering constantly above their children. We need to let kids be kids. When we were younger we used to hear and talk about crazy things, and yet we turned out OK. My point is, we need to let them grow up by maturing the same way we did. Have a good Shabbos. YR On a totally separate note, beginning next week I will be writing a multi-part article about children going “Off the Derech”. I have spoken with so many parents and children on this topic. However, if anyone feels they have anything to share, please email me at [email protected], as soon as you can. Thank you in advance.
19 Comments
Eddie L.
6/29/2017 05:56:24 pm
" Of course, being the quiet type" Ha. I'm guessing you are being sarcastic. in any case, you are 100% correct. It's OK for kids to grow up without their parents watching their every move.
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Aryeh Leib
6/29/2017 09:04:45 pm
My father used to say, if you want your kids to grow up, let them be kids.
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Gabriella Pinter
6/29/2017 09:30:12 pm
The toothbrushing part was so true. My boys didn't even bother opening it. Another great article Rabbi Ross.
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Devora Scharf
6/29/2017 10:23:50 pm
A good counselor will make sure the kids brush and take showers. When you sign your kids up for camp, make sure that they hire good counselors. My kids were very good at either brushing or squeezing out just the right amount of toothpaste. :-)
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Retired Parent.
7/4/2017 04:20:41 pm
Many of the counsellors will be hired after children sign up for camp. Counsellors by nature of things don't usually come back often. The few who do after a couple of years are division heads etc
Chaya Mushka
6/29/2017 10:34:40 pm
Rabbi Ross - what I love about these emails, is that you say it like it is. That's why you have so many people signing up to your articles. It's actually refreshing. I have one He'arah. It's a good idea to talk to the counselor before camp and let him know that you'll be basing your visiting day tip on how well your son is taken care of. I wouldn't even correspond through the division head - I would ask him to call me directly. Most camps allow that.
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Chaviva Zedler
6/29/2017 09:40:16 pm
Here's the truth. The talk that you want parents to have...rarely happens. Parents just don't know how to talk to children these days. That being said, it would be great if kids learned this stuff in Yeshiva.
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Private
6/29/2017 10:03:11 pm
Agreed. In public schools they teach these things. It would be awesome if Yeshivos would kick in and take the lead.
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Judy Levine
6/29/2017 09:43:48 pm
Helicopter parenting should have been an entirely separate article. You can't just give one paragraph to a serious issue plaguing our communities. I'm actually really annoyed. You might be 100% correct, but it's an afterthought. Parents need to understand how wrong it is.
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Avigdor David
6/29/2017 09:57:36 pm
What you wrote about Frum, is quite interesting. Is that what the person meant by Frum? I don't think so. She probably meant more to the right, not that I have any clue what that means. It was very sweet to pretend she meant structure.
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Retired Parent
6/29/2017 10:10:29 pm
A child has to grow up.Most important thing in sleep away camp is safety & menchkite. Any learning is nice, but much more important is that child does not get pushed off the derech to around 22. He has to learn to gradually separate, behave properly. Worry about the big picture not how many glatt he learned. I am half a century removed from these questions, do I remember Gemarrah from Yeshiva? Of course not, I went until 22.but I clearly remember which Rebbeim and friends were Menachem and which were not.
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A Zaidy
6/29/2017 10:13:46 pm
When I sent my boys to camp, it was a wee bit different that nowadays. We didn't care about learning, Davening, or the kids feelings. It's not that we didn't love our kids, we just let them be. By the way, I really enjoy your emails. Is there anyway to make the bigger?
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John
6/29/2017 10:47:48 pm
Hi. I've commented a few times on this blog. I'm not Jewish, but I always enjoy your articles. I want you to be aware that many of the issues you describe, are similar to issues that all parents have, even Christian and Muslims. We don't want our children forgetting everything they learned during the summer. Your solutions are always on point, a good counselor is probably the best option out there. God bless!
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Fraydie
6/30/2017 01:34:08 am
I agree with most of what you write. My point of contention is, sending to a camp with only one friend. That's not really an option. Kids need more than one friend to have a good time.
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Chaviva Zedler
6/30/2017 02:12:33 am
I disagree with you completely. It's so frustrating that kids need friends in camp. Don't we want them to make new friends? One friend is more than enough. Otherwise, might as well keep them in yeahiva for the summer!
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Retired Parent
7/4/2017 04:27:50 pm
It is OK to go where one does not have friends as long as the camp is not dominated by kids from some other place. If the kid is in a bunk where others are friendly with each other it is a recipe for problems.
Private
6/30/2017 06:26:35 am
The point of the summer may be to give kids some downtime. It's also to make new friends. Having a bunk of kids from your class is not a good move.
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Shlomo M.
6/30/2017 07:41:37 am
Thank you for this. There is a trend going on these days in which parents live vicariously through their children. That's not the worst part though, it's that they make every decision for the kids. How can they grow up if they can't make mistakes?
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A yiddishe mameh
6/30/2017 08:31:41 am
Davening in camp and learning in camp should be priorities. However, a person can't send his child to a camp and expect the child to change in a positive way based on the camp experience. As you pointed out, most kids move a drop backwards over Camp. If it bothers you that much should be sending to a different camp .
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AuthorRabbi Yitzie Ross is a Rebbe and has been working with parents and kids for many years. You can read more about him in the "about" section. Archives
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